Interesting article thread

[MrTwosheds]

No, but don't expect them to die for your silly paper game of who can own the most, it is not real. Push it too far and people will just say stuff your rules and take what they want. Push it too far and the living system that really supports us fails and money becomes just more trash blowing round the bodies. This year your crops failed, are you hungry? no. Someone else is starving for you.

[Red Devil]

we don't use paper for money any more

[AcneVulgaris]

"we should give all or most of our hard-earned money to someone who doesn't have any?"

Thats what Jesus taught, RD. He was pretty explicit. Are you a follower of his?

If you don't feed them, there's the practical matter of having millions of starving people rioting and raising hell. Makes it hard to run retail operations safely and profitably.

IMHO, receipt of welfare should require birth control until several years after the person gets back on their feet. Having kids in that situation isn't good for anybody... but the "christians" that run half our government flip out at the very idea of birth control, but don't want to do anything to help the children that result from the policy.

So we essentially pay protection money to keep the poor docile, as their numbers double, and redouble. The rise of automation ensures there will NEVER be jobs for these people, so even more so than in the past, the solution is to find a reason to get them to kill each other.

Be patient RD. You'll be spending that money on bombs soon enough. Maybe even sooner than you think:

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/featur ... 71733.html

[Nielk1]

Guilt is something you feel only when it is too late to take responsibility...

No, that is shame.

Good god, you guys can't even get the semantics right.

[MrTwosheds]

we don't use paper for money any more

So all the poor need to do is turn off the power...

[Ded10c]

Funny how so much of the American right wing are Christian zealots of the worst possible kind, yet completely fail to take heed of the teachings of their own religion.

[AcneVulgaris]

Guilt is something you feel only when it is too late to take responsibility...

No, that is shame.

Good god, you guys can't even get the semantics right.

How can they? They don't possess The Pompous Twit Semantics Handbook.

[Nielk1]

Guilt is something you feel only when it is too late to take responsibility...

No, that is shame.

Good god, you guys can't even get the semantics right.

How can they? They don't possess The Pompous Twit Semantics Handbook.

Inc. magazine? Cause that is where I picked up the Guilt vs Shame with respect to leadership thing. You know, from a publication about 100s of entrepreneurs, leaders in their business, making names for themselves and making lives for all their employees (until the government comes in and f*cks it up).

Here are some pointed questions:
Why do we have to pay for birth control for other people to protect their rights, what about our rights to buy what we want?
Why do we have to give money to those who do nothing and are we punished if we try to do something (entrepreneurship)?
Why is it the "christian's" fault that women don't have birth control; not only is it already affordable and available hundreds of places in a single town, but some places give it out free altruistically and without being forced to by the government.
Why does being successful instantly make you 'evil' in the eyes of your prospective employees and make you a target?
Why can anyone vote without proving they are even allowed to vote when the actual votes are anonymous and cannot be undone if it is later proven they were illegal?
Why get a job if the amount you make is subtracted from your welfare? (Why work for $20 and get $80 from the gov when you can sit on your ass and collect the full $100?)
Why do we require drug tests for many jobs but not for a job supplement (welfare)?
Why do you no longer count as 'unemployed' in official statistics if you don't find a job within a certain amount of time?
Why are you not required to look for a job when on job supplement (welfare)?
Why is it 'racist' to say anything about physical attributes alone, but anything goes if the subject is white?
Why is it 'sexist' to disagree with a women?
Why is a 'racist' to disagree with a black man/woman?
Then why isn't it racist when a black republican is attacked for misusing/misappropriating/what have you his race or told flat out that he does not exist?
Why is it bad to expect personal responsibility from someone, but not to take from someone else to help them?

[MrTwosheds]

Answers from the British perspective.
1. I don't know.
2. Because you are property and must not get above your station.
3. No idea what your talking about.
4. It doesn't, It's usually a failure to share the product of success with employee's, that causes that.
5. I don't know, why do you do that?
6. To keep bean counters in a job and the poor, poor.
7. Who TF let employers drug test you? How is this compatible with any concept of freedom?
8. To make the numbers look good.
9. Over here you are forced to.
10. I think your being paranoid, say what you want.
11. Better argue with a woman about that one...
12. It isn't.
13. No idea what your talking about.
14.Its all about dis-empowerment, controlling people, denying them access to resources, so that the status of others can be preserved.

[Red Devil]

i think your mindset has been brought on by the fact that you call yourselves, "subjects" and that you "swear fealty" to your monarch, and thus live in a society determined by, "class" and the ever-present british, sniff when people talk down to others.

over here, things are different. over here, the individual is the sovereign and we are encouraged to become better than what we are born into. nay, not only encouraged, but even expected to.

over there, you've had "subservience to the crown" drummed into your head since you could understand it.

over here, we have a saying: "every man a king - and his home is his castle" - which still applies today, even though there are forces at work trying to turn us into you, china, cuba, et al.

the main idea behind our war for independence here was, "are we not men?? screw the crown!".

you should do the same before your entire middle (economic) class is gone - if it isn't already gone...

[Nielk1]

On some of the ones you answered I think you didn't have any idea what I was talking about either.

1. -
2. -
3. I was referring to AcneVulgaris's post, which has one of the common sentiments I hear, that evil Christians are preventing women from exercising their rights, so we better force them to give out birth control.
4. For example, it is NEVER contingent on what you said in number 4, at least not here. Here, if you make money, you are evil, you are the 1%, yada yada yada.
5. In America, there is currently a big stink bout different states enforcing that you must have a photo ID to vote, despite the fact they also have free photo ID programs for those who do not have said IDs already. There are thousands of fraudulent votes cast in US elections.
6. (The story behind this is that the Republicans thought at the time that welfare was a stigma people wanted to be out of, and the dems though of it as assured democratic voters and realized human nature.)
7. Drug tests are required for all sorts of positions. Some places require more than just the one. It is part of the hiring process. My current job didn't do it, but they had paperwork that said they could.
8. -
9. I like your way.
10. Believe it or not, I am not being paranoid. It is actually like that here. Racism has taken a full 180. The concept is called "reverse racism", which is in itself stupid because that implies that racism can only exist by white people for other people, and racism is in actuality a universal evil.
11. har har
12. It can be here. The "you people" thing is the most stereotypical, but basically, if you disagree and continue to debate, eventually, you will be labeled a racist. It is inevitable. Married to someone of another race? That's just to trick people into thinking you aren't racist. Donated mountains of cash to minority help groups, that is just a conspiracy to keep them down.
13. We actually had this happen, a black republican was subject to a massive amount of hate speech from various liberal sources, be they black, white, or purple, and in every case it was *not* racism. Where as if a white republican says something disparaging about the policies of a black democrat, he's just a racist and a bigot. (Seriously, look this up! So damn sad. I sound like a nut case, frankly the system is *designed* to make me sound like a nut case, but check the actual news reports and things.)
14. -

EDIT:
My famous phrase, well not online but IRL, was said when the news anchors were overjoyed at Obama's election to president saying that it was "A great day in America that a Black man could be elected president". I said "Nay, it is not a great day, for it will be a great day when a black man (or woman) is elected president and no one sees fit to mention his race but as a factor of physical description; and when that mention of physical description is made no-one decry it or the phrase containing it as racism." Right now, if I was to ask someone to point out an individual, and there were 2 options of different race, they would make all effort possible not to use the most obvious physical descriptor to select one, and instead go on to the myriad of clothing items and even facial expressions to avoid saying it. That isn't tolerance, that's fear.

[Psychedelic Rhino]

The gaff master is back on a roll. . .

[MrTwosheds]

We don't call ourselves subject's, its what we are called by the "state".
I have never sworn fealty to anyone or been asked to.
Nobody does any drumming of subservience. (the US does a lot more of this than we do.)
There are still Class issues, but they are not really any different from those you seem to be developing in the US.
Being a of particular class is not defined by economics at all. However being of a particular class will probably define your economics...
Drug tests can be demanded in my profession, for very good reasons. If any other employer, without a very good reason asked I would decline out of principle. My body is my business. Drug legality is just (very stupid) politics. Its also such an easy thing to spike someone, for a drug test the levels could be so low they wouldn't even know it had been done. Employers should judge you face to face and by your work.

[Psychedelic Rhino]

If any other employer, without a very good reason asked I would decline out of principle. My body is my business. Drug legality is just (very stupid) politics.

Come in reeking of weed and beer (make sure you're completely sober) and tell your boss it's not his business and see how well that works for ya.

[MrTwosheds]

I would not question their right to judge me on my habits, just their right to subject me to forensic examination. Once that approach becomes normal, where does it end? Our analysis shows us that you are a Jew, walk this way please. Don't think it will just stop at particular substances that some people happen to enjoy, the potential for abuse is unlimited. One law that is clearly needed world wide, is an absolute legal guarantee that human genetic material or products derived from, cannot be patented by anyone unless it is actually their own genetic material. A straight forward legal confirmation of our self ownership. Also the right to refuse analysis of that material unless crimes of a certain level are being investigated. Anyone who thinks freedom/privacy is remotely important cannot afford to overlook the potential abuses advancing technology could be used for.