A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

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A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by TheJamsh » Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:36 pm

Pardon the wall of text.

I haven't played Battlezone II properly for months (this isn't a "I quit" thread, read on), but recently I've decided to contribute all of the efforts I made on the now-dead Serenesis mod (the name makes me cringe) towards the Community Project 2, in a bid to see both my hard work pay off and get used, and also see the CP2 actually come to be, and maybe prove a little more aesthetically and audibly pleasing than it may currently be. I'm hoping the team will be able to find uses for most if not all of my things, but there's a good chance that a lot of it won't make the final cut.

With that in mind, and after firing up BZ this week for the first time in what feels like an age to test-fire all those pretty weapons I made, I've decided to start work on something considerably smaller, so I can at least get a chance to show off some of this work and so that you lot get to try it out. The current plan, is to construct a simple single-player mission, in which all Serenesis assets to date will make an appearance, so that everybody gets a chance to cause some carnage. Don't expect to see any new races or gloriously textured units (with the exception of the AAN Sabre Tank), I never got that far, but do expect some visually pleasing explosions, crunchy sound effects and a fun but somewhat short single player set of missions. The storyline will likely only involve the AAN as a race, and perhaps some of the CP1 races, but neither the Serenese nor any of the other planned races won't be there. I'd like it, but that amount of work would take forever and not give me an awful lot in return. I don't know what the situation is with Epic's assets now that Slaor has passed away, but I might like to use the odd few to expand the other races to match the AAN. If someone could let me know below, that'd be great.

I'm going to attempt to tie up as many loose ends as possible, such as finish all the units that at least got as far as the modelling stage, get all the weapons working and balanced amongst one another etc. Some things will require the help of others however, such as Jayden's texture skills and (if I can persuade him) a few of Nielk1's neat C++ modules (providing there's a way to integrate them with a BZS-script, which I doubt). I'm hoping the texture side of things won't be too difficult, as a lot of that will need to be done if the CP2 decides to use the models anyway. I'm not going to set a deadline, it's done when it's done.

IF I can stretch to it, I'll go as far as finishing the AAN race entirely, and packing it up into a simple Multiplayer package, where you'll be able to annihilate each other and the computer, and get a chance to use everything in a non-scripted environment in some pretty maps. This would take a lot longer though, so it depends on how much time I have and how much desire there is for it. Oh, and I also VOW not to release it early, like the UEP. Some of this work I'm going to have to do anyway to contribute it towards the CP2, I broke a lot of things making Serenesis and I don't want to give the CP2 team a headache.

The main event however, particularly for the remaining modders, is you can subsequently do whatever the hell you want with it. You can use the assets in your own projects, modify them out of recognition or do whatever, so long as I'm credited. You'll get your hands on every Max file, every Photoshop PSD and every original bit of work I have left. Just bear in mind that some of it isn't all my own work, and while I've done my best to modify it and ensure I'm not breaking any rules, don't go putting sound effects or models into commercial projects unless you want to risk your ass getting sued.

If you care for the reasons behind why I'm doing it, they are a) I miss BZ2 and b) I occasionally get bored. It'll be a while to figure out how long it's going to take, but I'll post videos & screens as I go along to keep your mouths watered (minus spoilers of course). I just refuse to have all this work eventually come to nothing, and I'd like at least a PART of Serenesis to see the light of day. Nobody can leave BZ2 forever...

So... thoughts?
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by MrTwosheds » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:44 pm

I quite fancy a bargain bucket of explosions and fx, sounds are always really useful. Have you got any nice shrubbery's? :lol:
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by TheJamsh » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:49 pm

MrTwosheds wrote:I quite fancy a bargain bucket of explosions and fx, sounds are always really useful. Have you got any nice shrubbery's? :lol:
Haha, epic response. No shrubberies :(

BTW, it's been a while, when's that damn Dalek mod coming? Been holding on for that for ages... ever since you showed off that cool as hell APC with the skull heads...
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by Ded10c » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:41 pm

Slaor has always allowed people to use his stuff pretty much as and when they want. Every time somebody contacted him, the answer was always yes, normally provided with the odd helpful tip.
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by MrTwosheds » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:45 pm

when's that damn Dalek mod coming?
Oh just rebuilding stuff as usual...Doing a walker atm, Trying to persuade it to not look like a poodle with very long legs.
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by TheJamsh » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:49 pm

AHadley wrote:Slaor has always allowed people to use his stuff pretty much as and when they want. Every time somebody contacted him, the answer was always yes, normally provided with the odd helpful tip.
True, that's how it was when I contacted him about FE items. Seems okay to me then.

MrTwosheds wrote:Oh just rebuilding stuff as usual...Doing a walker atm, Trying to persuade it to not look like a poodle with very long legs.
As long as that mod remains unreleased, I will be here... I wont rest until I've set that APC on someone.
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by Zax » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:55 pm

Be careful you don't catch the bug again. Poking around inside asset files is all it takes.
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by Nielk1 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:27 pm

I can probably rig up a structure to hold the mid-way C file that the bz scriptor generates before making it all the way to DLL.

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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by General BlackDragon » Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:38 pm

Or I can just convert your script over to C++, or write it in C++ to begin with, it's not hard.
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by DarkCobra262 » Thu Jun 28, 2012 12:09 am

Wouldn't mind using some neat sounds and textures (ofc for my own amusement, non-release mods xD)

EDIT - speaking of which, anyone know where to get good weapon sounds?
Last edited by DarkCobra262 on Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by Nielk1 » Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:36 am

General BlackDragon wrote:Or I can just convert your script over to C++, or write it in C++ to begin with, it's not hard.
Except you can't, because there are special functions with hidden code that all scriptor scripts use for many functions, or do you expect a magical 1:1 relation.

Look for yourself, a lot of scriptor functions have no simple scriptutils analog. Now, I know I can re-create them pretty easily, but can you?

What is most annoying is that I have had this discussion with you before in IMs about other things and you simply decide to forget it and act like you know what to do, which last we discussed, you don't. Lets see you make that key function the Nexus in FE uses that allows it to fly from one location to another and spin at a given rate. Its some complex matrix operations and remember how long it took you just to get the portals you have working how you want. Fact is this is nearly arbitrary rotation, not 90 degree with building rotation, so good luck, because I am frankly tired of constantly helping you.

There are several other functions with the same issue, lets start by having you notice them.

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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by TheJamsh » Thu Jun 28, 2012 8:44 am

Nielk1 wrote:There are several other functions with the same issue, lets start by having you notice them.
If I remember rightly this applied to the 'GetByLabel' command that the BZS Scriptor has too, which allowed you to 'grab' an object that was already placed in the world by the Label you give it in the editor, rather than by ODF name or similar. If I poked around in C++ long enough I could probably figure out simple acts like telling this tank to move to this area etc, but I'd never get it foolproof. Just takes so bloody long to learn it all.

But yeah as you said, I can always export a 'C' file from the Scriptor and see how far that would get me...
DarkCobra262 wrote:Wouldn't mind using some neat sounds and textures (ofc for my own amusement, non-release mods xD)

EDIT - speaking of which, anyone know where to get good weapon sounds?
Well you are free to release them if you want as I said, I'm really not too fussed about that. We've all learnt from each other in some form or another, there's no point dampening the creative flow.

As for sounds, I've found the best way is to just find as many old PC games as you can and find out how people have managed to extract them. The only way you're really going to get similar and original results of your own is if you've been head sound design honcho at codemasters for 10 years or something... So long as you manipulate them so they sound nothing like the original, you should be just fine. I think overall, short audio samples under a certain length are actually okay to sample and re-use, provided you credit the original author(s) of it. That might only apply to music though, not sure.
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by General BlackDragon » Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:51 pm

Getbylabel is the following:

Handle TempHandle = GetHandle("LABELNAME");



Also, I STILL have NOT gotten my portals to work "the way I want." :(

Yes, The scirptor can do matrix rotations, whooo....That's still possible in C++.

I know how to do N S E W, :D Just, calculating matrix differences I still don't know how to do..

And moving is just setting velocity.


But yea, I wasn't talking about using the C file the scriptor outputs, I was referring to taking something like this:

[routine "Bla",1,true]
GetPlayer,PHandle
SetObjective,"Noodles"

into

Handle PHandle = GetLocalPlayerHandles();
ClearObjecitves();
AddObjective("Noodles", RED);

Etc...
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by MrTwosheds » Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:35 pm

So long as you manipulate them so they sound nothing like the original, you should be just fine.
Ages ago I took a very short clip, from a very well known piece of film music, utterly mutilated it and used it as an engine sound, It retains just enough feel of impending threat, without actually sounding like music any more. Speeds up and slows down with the vehicle just like the music in the movie does. :)
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Re: A small(ish) but hopefully pleasing announcement...

Post by Nielk1 » Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:06 pm

General BlackDragon wrote:Yes, The scirptor can do matrix rotations, whooo....That's still possible in C++.
The scriptor says "spin at speed X and move this way"

The DLL says "set your tation to X and set your position to Z"

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