Battlezone Forums

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... -ever.html

Does it qualify as breaking and entering?

I have to point out that statistics without context mean nothing. Can we get some deeper aggregates or just the top levels where we don't know the subtypes?

Worth a double post I think considering the time difference. Here is what you are not considering:
Two of these statistics can be taken very different ways, for example:
1: Is the deaths high on one side because both are attacking each other, but one is more aggressive, or because one is using a turtling defense? Anyone who has played an RTS game should know that throwing piles of soldiers at a fortified base only causes your death count to rise factors faster than your enemy's.
2: On missile/mortar kills. If one side was to always fire a missile or mortar at the exact position from which the other fired, and the population density at each launch site was markedly higher on the agressor's side, wouldn't one expect far more casualties? If this possibility is true, then it might be the very plan of the possibly suicide mortar bombers to take as many out with them as possible in a 'suicide by cop' style situation.

Here is another example of the issues with statistics using a theoretical instance:
There are more blacks in XYZ prison than whites, the justice system must be racist. Of course, there is the possibility that in that area, the black population happens to be more likely to break the law, but there is yet another possibility. What if the population from which the prison pulls its 'members' also has a higher black population than white. If we were to use the % of the surrounding population in prison along racial lines instead of the raw numbers, we might find an even split.

The truth of statistics is they are great when they are transparent. These aren't transparent, they are highly boiled down and set in a very strict frame of mind, probably meant to make you angry at Israel.

I tend to side with whatever side is better in 2 respects: better for the well-being of my nation, and better for the freedoms of those in the area. And, the fact of the matter is, you aren't going to be beheaded for being a Muslim in/near Israel. Regardless of who I side with however, you should consider how statistics and other misinformation is being used to skew your opinion one way or another.

Worth a double post I think

Not really The statistics for the Israeli /Palestine conflict tend to generally show about 40 Palestinian deaths for every Israeli death, its been like that for a long time, many of them are children shot by Israeli forces. In between moaning about paying for fellow Americans health care, maybe you should try finding some time to moan about all the financial support your government gives to Israel too. Attempting to redraw reality in others minds does not alter the fact that this is a conflict between a modern very well equipped military power and population of mostly seriously impoverished civilians. Yes of course they fight back any way they can.

MrTwosheds wrote:conflict between a modern very well equipped military power and population of mostly seriously impoverished civilians. Yes of course they fight back any way they can.

Thats a pretty nice understatement, seeing as ½ our western intelligence agencies receive 'their training'... but you may not read that as if they train in such way cause they see the other side as terrorists ...

Terrorists would be whoever was firing weapons into random civilian areas. Notes be to 'random' here, since a trike back at a weapon launching point isn't random.

No point in continuing this discussion.

edit: Ceasefire... Israel agrees to stop assassinating people and Hamas agrees to stop firing rockets.

MrTwosheds wrote:No point in continuing this discussion.

edit: Ceasefire... Israel agrees to stop assassinating people and Hamas agrees to stop firing rockets.

Assassination implies someone important was killed.

Nielk1 wrote:

MrTwosheds wrote:No point in continuing this discussion.

edit: Ceasefire... Israel agrees to stop assassinating people and Hamas agrees to stop firing rockets.

Assassination implies someone important was killed.

News recently said they had assassinated a number of Hamas leaders.

Yes. That was why they started firing rockets at Israel. A deliberately re starting of hostilities by Israel for political purposes.

MTS and AH,
I doubt very much that your presentation of facts will have much effect on those who exhibit the conditioned response of many in the US that anything Israel does is OK as they have been taught such through formal education and relentless media indoctrination (I’ve long stated that TV and radio presentations are called programming for a very good reason).

I found that the site from which I have selected the following links to offer a very educational view diametrically opposed to that which prevails in the US. As this site purports to express facts about a religion that I have very little knowledge of, I do not if this stuff is true or not. However it is a viewpoint that I had only previously seen alluded to in rather dubious sources.

http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/media ... t_2005.mp3

http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/resou ... Accuse.pdf

My biggest issue with this whole situation is that US citizens are bankrolling this insanity to the point fiscal ruination.

US taxpayers paid more to Israeli defense budget than Israelis

The Costs to American Taxpayers of the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict: $3 Trillion

As the $3 Trillion value was computed in 2002 and we have experienced the Iraq and Afghanistan wars since then at a publically claimed bill of about a $1 Trillion, we can probably say $4 Trillion flushed down the toilet for this insanity (Approximately 25% of the current US government debt load).

Even worse, does not include the cost in human suffering on all sides.

On a lighter side:

Optical Camouflage Renders The Backseat Of A Car Transparent

As the $3 Trillion value was computed in 2002 and we have experienced the Iraq and Afghanistan wars since then at a publically claimed bill of about a $1 Trillion, we can probably say $4 Trillion flushed down the toilet for this insanity (Approximately 25% of the current US government debt load).

International benefit claimants! now I can see why they find peace so threatening.

TnT wrote:...

Considering that lately the media here in America has so skillfully swayed the populous to near antisemitic levels of thoughtless hate, you are entirely incorrect. Most Americans at this moment mindlessly hate Israel without actually thinking about how much worse the other parties are. The truth is, everyone likes to think in a vacuum, ignore the fact that you are choosing between a bunch of **** options and just imaging one is evil and anything else is better. (It is this lack of complex thoughts that allows the media to so easily say one party is vile evil scum and everyone pile on without considering the other parties.) I'd far prefer Israel over the other options, but if people continue to be so easily swayed the entire region is going to become a sheet of glass.

Dirty girl: http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/11/ ... EnoughNews