So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod...

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TheJamsh
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So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod...

Post by TheJamsh »

This has been my latest mini-project this last week, updating the stock weapons. Starting with the ISDF so they can integrate into the AAN.

I'm tidying up some loose ends and working on a couple of new SFX to break the weapon explosions apart some more, and you can only see the combat-version effects in this video, but they look and sound pretty good! Who'd have thought this was all possible pretty much in BZ2's stock engine ;)?

Weapons covered:

- AT Pulse Stabber
- AT Super-Stabber
- AT Stabber
- Minigun
- Chain Gun
- Mortar

Watch The Video On YouTube
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by Ded10c »

Absolutely beautiful.
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Zero Angel
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by Zero Angel »

Sort of gets a 'meh' response from me. The Pulse stab looks nice though and I like the idea of the holographic projection from the weapon crates (though I think it could be brighter). I also think the minigun should look blue again.

Another thing I noticed and kind of liked was how the SP-Stab had tank shell physics which seems kind of cool though I think it drops too much. If you could find a way to reduce the shell drop without increasing the velocity of the weapon I think it would be a nice weapon. I also think the SP-Stab could have a slightly 'dirtier' look particularly when it hits something. And I also think that the AT-Stab could also use tank shell physics, be of higher velocity and do more damage to N armor in particular (and maybe a little more to L armor), since one of the things that has bugged me balance-wise about AT-Stab is that it has always been as powerful (DPS-wise) as minigun but its lower velocity made it an inferior weapon in all aspects even though tank cannons are supposed to be better than guns.
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TheJamsh
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by TheJamsh »

The speed of the weapons hasn't been altered except the mortar shell, but the cannons are just 'grenade' class instead of bullet class. Basically they are high-speed mortars with short(ish) lifespans, and of course are affected by the overall gravity of the map. I can't change the arc of the shots unfortunately unless the speed is increased or unless i change map gravity, but in doing so i'd have to shorten the lifespan again, and the weapon would be easier to get kills with, AND ship physics would be affected.

I wanted to give the pulse stab grenade physics but its not possible, as the classLabel 'pulse' doesn't work on other classes. However, Im hoping that the pulse cannon will get more use now that its the only straight-shot weapon in the ISDF cannon arsenal besides plasma and MAG (both of which are seemingly under-used). SP and AT stabs have the same damage they do in stock, just doubled shot lifespans to double the range (I plan on doing this with all weapons, the absurdly short range of weapons in BZ2 annoyed me a lot, this seems far more realistic to me).

The advantages of using grenade physics are that SP and AT stab instantly become more effective at hitting turrets which sit behind small hills. The shots can arc over bumpy terrain whereas guns cannot. Turrets will be re-designed to compensate for this slightly with a higher gun-point, but the additional effectiveness of cannons over guns should then make cannons a more worthwhile choice.

Also, the minigun is still bluey-purple :P, the chain gun is the orange/yellow one. Both guns leave light smokey trails too. This video is mainly just to show the particle systems and SFX off a bit, rather than weapon balance. Thats not really something I can show with a video, that will have to be tried-and-tested once the AAN has been fully designed.

Furthermore, the mortar range has increased dramatically. I find it odd that mortars (by definition, a long range arcing shell) can be out-ranged easily by light cannons. I increased the speed and therefore range, but made it loose accuracy the further it travels, and gave it a mid-length lifespan to prevent cross-map shooting, and boosted the fire delay from 2 seconds to 3 seconds (the explosions are heavy on particle effects).
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Zero Angel
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by Zero Angel »

Havent tried it myself yet, but in the Sticky Mortar topic...
Red Devil wrote:there is the isArcing ODF entry you can put under [OrdnanceClass] that should/might allow leaders to arc like a mortar.
I dont know if this will work for pulse ordnance but it's worth a try.
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TheJamsh
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by TheJamsh »

isArcing doesn't actually do that im afraid, all it does is tell the TLI indicator that the ordnance will arc, and the TLI needs to adjust as so.

For example, make a cannon fire a grenade class, the TLI will point at the center of the craft. Now make a cannon fire a grenade class with isArcing = 1, and the TLI will adjust as such. Its a shame it doesn't work like that though i've got to say...
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by Clavin12 »

Tell me, do you write the ODFs from scratch or do you copy and paste? Oh, and, S-mod?
Last edited by Clavin12 on Tue Apr 12, 2011 2:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by General BlackDragon »

Blast you! FSB mod has new weapon renders too, and arcing bullets....

:evil:
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by labmice00 »

I believe S-mod is Serenesis mod.
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by TheJamsh »

S-Mod is indeed Serenesis Mod. And LOL GBD ;) What is FSB mod btw?

And as for the renders, I write them from scratch. I try to avoid copy & paste where possible so that everything looks more randomized. I went through and used the stock weapon ODF's because they were mostly staying the same, damage wise etc. Also, the new renders has to be slightly reminiscent of old stuff so that things still resembled their counterparts.

EDIT:
Also, the difficult part of revamping stock, especially with things like cannons is that you have to remember how often they will be used, and how many will be on screen at a time. I'm testing all this on a mid-range laptop and although it runs well, a big battle will cause an FPS hit. You also have to take BZ2's culling system into play as well, so effects can't stick around for TOO long, or the culling will make them looks terrible when there are more than two or three at once. The difficulty is getting the effect to appear realistic and exactly how you want it to be, but at the same time make room so the engine can draw a lot at once.

Not going to lie, you WILL need a decent PC/laptop to play this smoothly when the entire battlefield is spruced up to this LOD. I'm running at 30 tps with Serenesis and plan to make the release version run in 30TPS as well, so explosions and behaviour in general seem more 'instant' than in stock and not delayed. In fact, everything runs so much more smoothly, even the craft handle better. I don't think there IS a higher TPS setting.
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by Ded10c »

Still not sure about arcing the stabbers, if pulse won't do it.
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TheJamsh
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by TheJamsh »

There is no way to get pulse to arc and still be a pulse weapon. I could give it the same visual and audio effect no problem, but actually causing damage from those pulses is not possible.

I kind of prefer it though, Pulse is already fairly deadly (and VERY under-used). I'm hoping that as its now the only straight-shot cannon, it will get some useage to those who find the arcing ordnance hard to aim. And believe me, with box collisions turned on, dogfights with those new AT and SP stabbers are DAMN hard to score hits with. Pulse is a bit easier, as there doesn't have to be any gravity leading.

With these weapons, longer-range kills are easier with the AT and SP stabs, and you have more chance of surviving even though the fight is lengthy. The pulse stab is like the shotgun of the cannons, its more more effective and reliable in closer range fights. If you are floating around in a scout, you will definitely die versus a pulse sabre, so cannons finally power over guns. The guns dont have the same range that the AT and SP stabs have, so you get a range advantage as well as an arc advantage.

Plasma and Mag will still be straight shot, my thoughts are that the low-mass of energy-based weapons like these wouldn't really feel the effects of gravity... Pulse kinda looks energy based.

EDIT: I've just feature-requested the ability to make all ordnance types arc like grenades. Lets see where that goes.
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by Zero Angel »

TheJamsh wrote:S-Mod is indeed Serenesis Mod. And LOL GBD ;) What is FSB mod btw?
FSB means "Full Spectrum Bulldog". It's a mod uses only the Bulldog assault tank.
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Re: So anyway, I've been re-vamping stock weapons for S-mod.

Post by General BlackDragon »

lolz?

Furies Strike Back

it's kindof a pet project of mine
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